Is it time to bite the bullet??

chris nz · New User Joined: 25 Jun 2006 Posts: 9

I was dx Dec 03, psa 6.1, 1 of 8 cores +, gleason 3+3 'low grade'. after biop PSA rose and did not drop below 11. tried various can't fail remedies, found Prostasol in sept 04, PSA dropped to 0.5, varied the dose according to PSA and tried other supplements, PSA now 2 on 4 caps/week, my lifestyle is almost vegan. Recently I have been having thoughts that I should be more pro-active , seeds of doubt have been sown about my protocol by authodox practitioners, by the same token my onco said 'carry-on doing what you are doing and come back in 10 years', My blood work comes back boringly mid range, Are there any definitive tests I can take to determine the cancerous state of my prostate and cancer generally [ I have a family history of cancer] and put my mind at rest? Meanwhile I am formulating a plan B, My age is 65.
best regards and wishes in our mutual battle, chris nz
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chris nz
where there is a will,there IS a way

brainman

Hi Chris. The PSA is the best if not only blood test that will show any indication of Prostate Cancer. When did you have your last CT and bone scans?
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chris nz · New User Joined: 25 Jun 2006 Posts: 9

Hi Jim, had none, only ultrasound of pelvic area, just gave volume of prostate
best c
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chris nz
where there is a will,there IS a way

Replicant · Moderator Joined: 01 Nov 2006 Posts: 271

According to Dr. Walsh, PSA is not a good gauge of how fast cancer is progressing:

"...in men who already have prostate cancer, following changes in PSA is less helpful over time. About 25 percent of men with prostate cancers *that are growing* do not have a big increase in their PSA levels. Thus, just because your PSA isn't high and just because your PSA isn't going up, that doesn't mean you don't have cancer and that it isn't dangerous."

("Dr. Patrick Walsh's Guide to Surviving Prostate Cancer", 2nd ed., 2007, p. 152-153.)

I wasn't clear from your original post if you had tried for a cure through surgery and/or radiation, or if you were doing watchful waiting (expectant management). It sounds like, since you still have a prostate, you have opted so far not to go for aggressive tx.

If you're doing watchful waiting, the only way to get an idea of what the tumor(s) are doing is to get regular exams and biopsies:

"...if you're a man under age sixty-five with a life expectancy greater than ten years and localized, curable prostate cancer who decides to watch and wait--with the hope that if the cancer grows, it will be caught in time--think hard about this risk. *You are the man with the most to lose*. You should return to your doctor at regular intervals--every six months--for repeat digital rectal examinations, PSA tests (even though PSA doesn't always go up correspondingly when cancer advances), and periodic prostate biopsies to help the doctors find out if the cancer that's in your prostate is staying put or if it's on the move. PSA tests alone aren't sufficient to monitor the growth of the cancer."

(Walsh, p. 234)

Hope that helps.

chris nz · New User Joined: 25 Jun 2006 Posts: 9

thanks replicant, certainly puts a new slant on my thinking.
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chris nz
where there is a will,there IS a way

johnw100

"Are there any definative tests?"

In the context of small indolent tumors which are now often found due to more extensive screening, the answer is no.

Biopsy can miss a small tumor: Mine had 1 positive sample and PIN in 2004, with prior and subsequent biopsies clear.

As suggested, PSA isn't necessarily definitive. It can be influenced by various things including more PSA being produced by an enlarged prostate, which is common as we age.

The Diagnostic Center for disease Sarasota claim good results with their testing techniques, but generally testing equipment does not give the clear cut results often published.

chris nz · New User Joined: 25 Jun 2006 Posts: 9

also on my list of anomalies is the question ' how many truly successful treatments are there?' One reads of RPs' and RTs' etc, but in the next sentence the recipient is taking one or other of the chemo drugs or HT to manage their PCa. To weigh up the pros' and cons' of "authodox' treatments one has to consider the QOL post treatment. and reading some of the posts that is questionable. But i suppose those with successful treatment don't need the support and info of sites such as this one and therefor are we getting a biased interpretation? food for thought?? regards chris
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chris nz
where there is a will,there IS a way

Replicant · Moderator Joined: 01 Nov 2006 Posts: 271

Not all men are cured by primary treatment. But by all accounts, since the PSA era began and more men began to get diagnosed before advanced disease, about 2/3 of patients ARE cured by their primary treatment (most commonly prostatectomy but also the various modalities of radiation).

So most men get their treatment and then go on to live their lives. When they have problems (like me) they then hang around these boards. So the boards are going to be weighted in that direction.

All treatments have at least the potential of side effects. There is one treatment that I know of that is widely acclaimed by patients as having very little to zero side effects--proton beam therapy. I did not have that done, but I explored it.

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